Ray Films

HONDO

I was thinking  about providing information on Australian independent film distributors of the 1950's & 1960's starting with Ray Films followed by IFD ( Independent Film Distributors ) but what is holding me back is the apparent, on a whole,  lack of interest show in some of my previous postings. Some are not even viewed to see what they are all about let alone any comments recorded. Quizzes are mainly ignored even when I virtually hand the answer over. I spend a lot of time in preparing these quizzes along with information on Australian film history. It feels like who cares .It also appears most of the members are into restoring film posters, which is fine, without much interest shown in the history behind the posters and using the site as  a social outlet on a lot of subjects no way connected with the forum, which by the way is titled Vintage Movie Poster Forum. I am ready to brace myself for some flack but please fire away as I am bound to receive replies more than I receive for my postings. I have to write this as my frustration has been building. I am prepared to leave the forum if required and am eager to receive some feedback.I think what sparked me off to write this is on my Warner Bros. Connection Quiz posted four days ago I said"Let me know if anyone is interested in me posting another five Warner Bros. actresses. If I receive five people saying yes I will do so''. Was it 5 replies,4 replies, 3 replies, 2 replies or I reply. No it was a  big zero that have been posted or should I say not posted.. 

Hondo

Sven

..

David

Not everyone is on here every day, almost everyone of us work or make like we do - the reality is sometimes reading is all we can offer after a long day. Today I spent 5 hours of 14 in a car in bloody crap weather driving at a speed that makes walking like an Olympic sprint, do I feel like writing?

Nope. 

And that was the polite answer. Give people time to catch their breath, sometimes we're just not going to write.

It's up to you if you leave, it's up to you if you stay - everyone would miss your knowledge and contribution to bettering our own knowledge of daybills etc. But be fair, I don't do the crossword everyday either...

theartofmovieposters

Like I said before, I don't and have never posted, just for the sake of posting...if I can offer something which I think is valuable or meaningful, I will.  Else, I sit, I read and learn. 

I can only say I would miss your contributions to the forum very much...I have already learned a lot about my beloved daybills...and hope to learn a lot more.

Don't take it to heart if people don't always post.

As to discussing topics not movie poster related...I think if all we focus on is the pretty paper, we miss out on learning about the people on the forum, which I have to say I quite like.  I've meet a few now and I don't think that would have happened if all we did was discuss daybills...you get a feel for a person's personality when they post about other things...

Charlie

OK first thing, no one will ever require to leave the forum over an honest statement of feelings.

Hondo you have become a valued member here, and I personally want you to stick around keep posting and having fun.  But this is all about pace... At first your posts and quizzes were like a refreshing wave.  Heck I spent 3-4 hours at work trying to guess those characters on the stock daybill.  But I after a month or so I just couldn't keep up...  I'm a pretty busy guy and just couldn't keep investing the time to enjoy your posts.  Even though I knew I would get into them once I started.  Also remember despite this forum housing a lot of Aussies, there are other collectors here that interests don't align with your own.  I for example have mentally categorized your post as Australian poster/film related.  This only moderately holds my interest and if I am busy, well it goes on the back burner. 

I am an admin/mod and I will admit I haven't even had time to plow through all the new quizzes and posts.  I think for the pace you have been set on, the rest of the forum members have done a wonderful job responding.   

My suggestion is to work on the pace, the content is wonderful and can't be beat.  Let's also close out some of the older threads before starting new ones.  No one responded to my new theory on the Danny Kaye one sheet???   You could also consider an interval approach to the quizzes.  Say every Monday you post a new quiz.  I don't know your current rate but I think 1 quiz week at an expected time will get more attention.

This is just a public space for us to play.  We are all leading different lives, have different priorities (that change), responsibilities (that change), interests...

Charlie

David said:

But be fair, I don't do the crossword everyday either...

I won't ever do your damn crossword...

Charlie

theartofmovieposters said:

I think if all we focus on is the pretty paper, we miss out on learning about the people on the forum, which I have to say I quite like.  

This is so true at times.  I come now as much for the people as I do to brag about new purchases...

110x75

Charlie couldn't have said it better. I myself have been a lot less time in the forums lately, due to... life.
I do enter almost daily and read the posts I am more interested in, or that are related to my collecting interests.
I can't contribute almost anything interesting on daybill-related threads (except on crappy duotone daybill threads, I love those!), but I consider that the fact that all that knowledge and research keeps making it to the forum is great. Wheter there's a lot of responses or not.

Eisenhower

I agree with so many of the comments made before me. Hondo, I too hope that you do not leave the forum. I have learned more about Australian posters and Daybills than I would have sought out on my own in such a short amount of time. But agree that I just can't keep up with the amount of quizzes and other information that is posted, and like Matias said, my knowledge on daybills is so limited I have little to nothing to say at this point, but do enjoy reading & learning when time permits. For me, this forum has been a great place to post & get feedback regarding my purchases, encouragement for my restoration efforts, poster knowledge, and of course learning about others and reading comical posts which helps alleviate the stress of life. 

John

I agree with the comments. Even though there might be a lot of members there is only a small number who actually post and time is always an issue for all of us. In the past couple of months, there has been more information than ever about Australian posters. That is a great thing but sometimes hard to keep up with everything,

HONDO

I'm back. Thank you for all those who expressed kind thoughts and support and also those who explained their everyday situations regarding their forum participation.

Now that I am  back and feeling refreshed after a few days away, and although I am keen to share my knowledge with you all, i have decided to post only limited new postings in the future. First of all i intend to wind up all my current threads  before I post any new threads

Hondo

[Deleted User]

HONDO

This is a title I was intending to write about. Have some details and I will post them soon.

Hondo

Sven

Chris..Stop posting all these top film noir u r clogging up my want list! Love that fear in the night!!

Sven

HONDO said:

I'm back. Thank you for all those who expressed kind thoughts and support and also those who explained their everyday situations regarding their forum participation.

Now that I am  back and feeling refreshed after a few days away, and although I am keen to share my knowledge with you all, i have decided to post only limited new postings in the future. First of all i intend to wind up all my current threads  before I post any new threads

Hondo

Welcome back!!

HONDO

Thanks Sven

Hondo

[Deleted User]

HONDO said:

This is a title I was intending to write about. Have some details and I will post them soon.

Hondo

I'd love to read more about it.  It seems, on the surface at least, that when Ray Films re-released the film they somehow acquired Paramount's old poster stock and modified them to suit their needs.  Now that's interesting!

[Deleted User]

Sven said:

Chris..Stop posting all these top film noir u r clogging up my want list! Love that fear in the night!!

Sorry sir - I have a weakness

David

A Richardson too?

HONDO

Ray Films appeared to have acquired the re-release rights, among many other libraries which i intend to write about more in detail one day, to some of  the Pine-Thomas and the Sol M. Wurtzel independently produced film libraries and started to re-release them theatrically in Australia staring in 1952 but the majority in 1953.

Pine- Thomas Productons was a prolific B -picture unit of Paramount Pictures from 1940 to 1955. William H. Pine  and William C. Thomas    were known as the ''Dollar Bills'' because none of their economically made films ever lost money,

Sol M. Wurtzel was another prolific producer of B films at 20th Century Fox. He developed a formula for creating consist money making B films including a large number of Charlie Chan and Mr. Moto films.

Both Pine-Thomas and Sol M. Wurtzel  had controlling rights to a lot of their 1940's releases and by the  early 1950's the controlling rights having reverted back to them the re-release rights were sold to small independent distributors. By the end of the 1950's television rights were made available for these titles.

Ray films in the early 1950's gained rights to an undetermined number of titles from Sol M.Wurtzel and Pine- Thomas productions.I am aware of at least thirteen films but there is bound to be more. Finding daybill and one sheet re-release product on any of these titles is extremely difficult but on the other hand paper from the original release Paramount and 20th Century Fox is easier to locate.

Interesting Jumbo window card Of a U.S. 1950's re-release of a double bill of two Sol M.Wurtzel productions with one featuring a very young Marilyn Monroe. You have to love it.

I have found only three titles where I have sighted both original and re-release paper.

The first title is Fear In The Night where the original Richardson / Paramout  daybill has been edited for the Ray Films re-release.The Paramount Presents is now  covered by Released By Ray Films , the bottom of the origiinal poster has been removed which had the Paramount logo, A Paramount Picture, Richardson credits and printer's credits on it. You can just notice the top of the removed logo.Of interest the original Not Suitable For General Exhibition has been changed to Suitable Only For Adult on the Ray Films daybill. 

The second title is Trouble Preferred where the original daybill poster has had the Released By 20th Century Fox information blanked out along with the 20th Century Fox logo being covered by the Ray Films logo.The original source material is from the U.S.A. but it does the job for comparison purposes.

The third title is Take It Big where the original paper it appears for whatever reason wasn't used but copied in the form of a duotone daybill Not exactly 100% the same but pretty close in copying the original.

t

Hondo

theartofmovieposters

So there were no copyrights over the artwork then I take it?

HONDO

HONDO said:

Interesting Jumbo window card of a U.S. 1950's re-release of a double bill of two Sol M.Wurtzel productions with one featuring a very young Marilyn Monroe. You have to love it.

t

Wonderful when someone becomes famous what an artist's mind can come up with.

The original release.

Hondo

[Deleted User]

David said:

A Richardson too?

Yes indeed

[Deleted User]

HONDO said:

Ray Films appeared to have acquired the re-release rights, among many other libraries which i intend to write about more in detail one day, to some of  the Pine-Thomas and the Sol M. Wurtzel independently produced film libraries and started to re-release them theatrically in Australia staring in 1952 but the majority in 1953.

Pine- Thomas Productons was a prolific B -picture unit of Paramount Pictures from 1940 to 1955. William H. Pine  and William C. Thomas    were known as the ''Dollar Bills'' because none of their economically made films ever lost money,

Sol M. Wurtzel was another prolific producer of B films at 20th Century Fox. He developed a formula for creating consist money making B films including a large number of Charlie Chan and Mr. Moto films.

Both Pine-Thomas and Sol M. Wurtzel  had controlling rights to a lot of their 1940's releases and by the  early 1950's the controlling rights having reverted back to them the re-release rights were sold to small independent distributors. By the end of the 1950's television rights were made available for these titles.

Ray films in the early 1950's gained rights to an undetermined number of titles from Sol M.Wurtzel and Pine- Thomas productions.I am aware of at least thirteen films but there is bound to be more. Finding daybill and one sheet re-release product on any of these titles is extremely difficult but on the other hand paper from the original release Paramount and 20th Century Fox is easier to locate.

Interesting Jumbo window card Of a U.S. 1950's re-release of a double bill of two Sol M.Wurtzel productions with one featuring a very young Marilyn Monroe. You have to love it.

I have found only three titles where I have sighted both original and re-release paper.

The first title is Fear In The Night where the original Richardson / Paramout  daybill has been edited for the Ray Films re-release.The Paramount Presents is now  covered by Released By Ray Films , the bottom of the origiinal poster has been removed which had the Paramount logo, A Paramount Picture, Richardson credits and printer's credits on it. You can just notice the top of the removed logo.Of interest the original Not Suitable For General Exhibition has been changed to Suitable Only For Adult on the Ray Films daybill. 

The second title is Trouble Preferred where the original daybill poster has had the Released By 20th Century Fox information blanked out along with the 20th Century Fox logo being covered by the Ray Films logo.The original source material is from the U.S.A. but it does the job for comparison purposes.

The third title is Take It Big where the original paper it appears for whatever reason wasn't used but copied in the form of a duotone daybill Not exactly 100% the same but pretty close in copying the original.

Hondo

Thank you Hondo - very informative.

I would think that perhaps on the original Paramount 'Fear in the Night' the Not Suitable For General Exhibition censor rating was actually a snipe or print over itself of the Suitable Only For Adults seen on the Ray Films copy (i.e. the Suitable Only For Adults is what was originally printed on the Paramount and Ray Films versions - the Ray Films being the basic Paramount copy but modified by the additional release snipe and trimming at the bottom)

[Deleted User]

John

 

Thank you Hondo - very informative.

I would think that perhaps on the original Paramount 'Fear in the Night' the Not Suitable For General Exhibition censor rating was actually a snipe or print over itself of the Suitable Only For Adults seen on the Ray Films copy (i.e. the Suitable Only For Adults is what was originally printed on the Paramount and Ray Films versions - the Ray Films being the basic Paramount copy but modified by the additional release snipe and trimming at the bottom)

Thats correct Chris. The original complete untouched daybill had the Suitable only for adults but had a Not Suitable for General Exhibition sticker added in the last ten years.

[Deleted User]

John said:

 

Thank you Hondo - very informative.

I would think that perhaps on the original Paramount 'Fear in the Night' the Not Suitable For General Exhibition censor rating was actually a snipe or print over itself of the Suitable Only For Adults seen on the Ray Films copy (i.e. the Suitable Only For Adults is what was originally printed on the Paramount and Ray Films versions - the Ray Films being the basic Paramount copy but modified by the additional release snipe and trimming at the bottom)

Thats correct Chris. The original complete untouched daybill had the Suitable only for adults but had a Not Suitable for General Exhibition sticker added in the last ten years.

John what do you mean by the "last ten years"?

HONDO

CSM said:

I like this daybill, I have a copy also.There is something interesting about it's Australian release that  i will write about soon. Just need to confirm some information first. To be continued ...

Hondo

John

John said:

Thats correct Chris. The original complete untouched daybill had the Suitable only for adults but had a Not Suitable for General Exhibition sticker added in the last ten years.

John what do you mean by the "last ten years"?

I believe that the Not Suitable sticker was stuck on because there was damage to the original logo.

[Deleted User]

John said:

John said:

Thats correct Chris. The original complete untouched daybill had the Suitable only for adults but had a Not Suitable for General Exhibition sticker added in the last ten years.

John what do you mean by the "last ten years"?

I believe that the Not Suitable sticker was stuck on because there was damage to the original logo.

Oh very interesting.  Implying that it was not stuck on at the time of the original release but very recently...

HONDO

Mystery Lake.

HONDO said:

CSM said:

I like this daybill, I have a copy also.There is something interesting about it's Australian release that  i will write about soon. Just need to confirm some information first. To be continued ...

Hondo

The mind plays tricks. I was confusing this title with Murder At 45 R.P.M, so this means I don't have any information except to say Murder at 3 A.M. was released in Sydney by Ray Films in 1957.

Hondo