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Ask Your Linenbacking & Restoration Questions

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  • CharlieCharlie Member, Administrator, Moderator, Game Master Posts: 6,152 admin
    Pancho said:
    I've come across a daybill that has several autographs on it. The daybill could probably benefit from some touch ups - it has tape staining and some small tears. Is it possible to do much with the poster without destroying the signatures?
    Depends on the ink...  If the autographs are sharpie they won't budge.
    That second mouse in the bowl of cream we call life...
    www.movieposterworks.com  | MPW on Facebook
  • DavidDavid Member Posts: 10,137 admin
    If they have been signed with a Sharpie pen and the posters/autographs are from 1963 or before then it doesn't matter, the Sharpie pen was only invented in 1964...
    David
  • PanchoPancho Member Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    Most look like sharpie, but one might be a more traditional black texta. That's gonna bleed like the proverbial stuck pig isn't it? (Pardon my French!)
  • CharlieCharlie Member, Administrator, Moderator, Game Master Posts: 6,152 admin
    I'm on sabatical...  Damn dog has messed up my washing table.  Will have to fix it.
    That second mouse in the bowl of cream we call life...
    www.movieposterworks.com  | MPW on Facebook
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin
    Hey Charlie, I've searched before & heard you & Dario mention, but what is meant by "clay based" poster paper?

    I've heard it mentioned, it is manufactured on the newer-post 1990 posters? What does this mean?

    And how does it affect the washing/linenbacking of posters? 

    Thx for any info/websites you can direct me too. 
  • CharlieCharlie Member, Administrator, Moderator, Game Master Posts: 6,152 admin
    http://www.conservatree.org/paper/PaperDesc.shtml


    You ou have to be more mindful of trapped water... I can only assume this is happening but sometimes water can get in between the clay layer and the paper layer.  Usually some wheat paste gets in there too but sometimes it doesn't and you end up with a void that is undetectable until you cut the poster down...

    That second mouse in the bowl of cream we call life...
    www.movieposterworks.com  | MPW on Facebook
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin
  • NTrederNTreder Member Posts: 1 ✭ Mexican Lobby Carder
    Does anyone have a recommendation for a company that provides linen backing services in Seattle?

    Thanks
  • CharlieCharlie Member, Administrator, Moderator, Game Master Posts: 6,152 admin
    No, but some of the best in the world are to the north in Canada (Dario) and to the south in California (Mario and poster mountain).
    That second mouse in the bowl of cream we call life...
    www.movieposterworks.com  | MPW on Facebook
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin

    Hey Charlie,

    Have you backed a 30x40? Was thinking of doing one early in the new year and was wondering about the wash process.

    Do you give it a longer soak because the paper is heavier? Any other considerations? Cal Hydrox & Bleach longer as well?

    Same as a half sheet; and to maybe relax fold lines?

    Thanks.

  • CharlieCharlie Member, Administrator, Moderator, Game Master Posts: 6,152 admin
    No I've not but have done several inserts and half sheets.  I would say the only difference is that you might want to chem treat on both sides.
    That second mouse in the bowl of cream we call life...
    www.movieposterworks.com  | MPW on Facebook
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin
    Thanks!  I have a beat up folded Young Frankenstein 30x40 which i'll test some longer soak/chem times on to see results.
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin

    I know this is kind of an open-ended/random hard to answer question, but when you look at poster prior to restoration, whether you are going to buy it as a restoration project in the future, or someone has asked or you've taken on a linenbacking project, what concerns you the most? The least?

    Tape-Existing on paper? Tape-Stains?

    Paper loss-Interior? Edges?

    Fold Line Separation?

    Stains- Water? Other?

    Thanks!


  • SvenSven Member Posts: 1,957 ✭✭✭✭ Three-Sheeter
    edited April 2017
    i would be concerned with the quality of paper...will it survive the wash, will the person be on the ball and be able to rescue it from the wash

    If artwork needs to be restored i want to have confidence in their ability to recreate...

    I guess it comes down to the exact expectations of the restoration vs skill set of the restorer and aligning the two...

    Do you want to to take on a restoration project Mark for someone? If so understand the specific requirements and let them know what can be realistically achieved, call out the risks...

    Not sure if i helped..spit balling whilst on a lunch walk from work!!


  • SvenSven Member Posts: 1,957 ✭✭✭✭ Three-Sheeter
    I dont worry about border wear , chips or light stains as i have confidence most restorers can address, but then i would not back it if these are the only issues
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin

     While I feel my restoration skills are in an infant stage at this point (mixing colors, laying them down, airbrushing, seamless MC infill and such).

    I agree with you in that fold separation is one of my major concerns during the wash stage; and saving the poster, laying it down accurately if multiple fold lines separate.

    As for image recreation, not sure I'd tackle that quite yet. Tape on a poster, tape stains, water stains don't worry me too much.

    No particular project for someone in mind other than posters I look at buying and restoring. Was just wonder what our members and Charlie look when buying a poster to restore and what challenges they see as most critical when buying paper that needs work.

    Good stuff Sven, and even better while on a lunch walk from work! :wink:


  • jayn_jjayn_j Member, Singin Dancing Fool, Lobby Master Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    well, I recently tried my hand at my first de-acidification, wash and tape removal of a lobby card.  Basically, it was a disaster.  I think I learned a lot, but I am going to need to work up my nerve before trying again.

    The card did clean up nicely and would be great with another wash.  What I missed was how delicate the top of the card was.  There was butcher tape on the top.  I tried to remove it with the card still wet and the top of the card sort of dissolved.  I now have a card with a bunch of bits the size of a dime and a lot of areas needing infill.  Card is not worth it, and that's why I chose it for my first attempt (besides, it was a duplicate)
    - Jay -
    Curmudgeon in training 
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin

    Great to hear your giving it a go. It's great fun!

    How did the deacidification and washing go? Were you going to use a weight/press method to dry?

    Is butcher tape like masking/paper tape? If you have Bestine, you can try to remove tape while tape is dry- just use protection as Bestine can be a bit harmful as has been mentioned.


  • CharlieCharlie Member, Administrator, Moderator, Game Master Posts: 6,152 admin
    I'll give this more of a go later but you can use a steamer on just about anything and it works like a hot butter knife on water based kraft type tape.
    That second mouse in the bowl of cream we call life...
    www.movieposterworks.com  | MPW on Facebook
  • jayn_jjayn_j Member, Singin Dancing Fool, Lobby Master Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    The washing went well until I tried to peel off the tape.  When I say butcher's tape I am referring to the brown paper tape that you moisten the glue to apply.

    I bought blotting paper and cut it down to 20x25".  placed the card in the middle of 4 layers of card and pressed it down with about 8-10 pounds of pressure.  After 24 hours, I reversed the papers so the wet ones were on the outside and let it dry for another 2 days.  Card came out flat.

    Card could stand another round of cleaning, but it disintegrated badly enough that I will probably leave it alone.  I took some before shots, and can take some after and post them to show what happened.  I will try again on another card that has better bones.  I need to gather a few where they have dirt and stains, but I don't really care if I ruin them.
    - Jay -
    Curmudgeon in training 
  • jayn_jjayn_j Member, Singin Dancing Fool, Lobby Master Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    OK, here are the before and after shots.  My guess is that I should have avoided doing the tape removal while the card was wet.  I was too aggressive in handling it.

    before front:


    before rear:



    And the disaster I created:


    Looking at it now, I thinking this was masking tape and not butcher/brown tape.  should have used Bestine before washing.
    - Jay -
    Curmudgeon in training 
  • SvenSven Member Posts: 1,957 ✭✭✭✭ Three-Sheeter
    Well jay you've given yourself another restoration project! Good on you for being brave to do it in the first place.

    Btw love Blue Hawaii paper! Elvis, Hawaii, blue sea, ...always makes me feel good!!
  • BruceBruce Member, Captain Movie Poster Posts: 799 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    Definitely masking tape. And you were discounting the major staining in the top. This is the kind that weakens the paper significantly, so you need to handle it quite differently from how you did, or it does "disintegrate".

    But it was a much lesser card anyway, and this is how you learn. But next time ask the boys for tips (based on posted images) before you start, not after!
    We (eMoviePoster.com) hold 3,000 auctions a week, 138,000 a year.
    See all of our current auctions in one gallery here: http://www.emovieposter.com/agallery/all.html
  • EisenhowerEisenhower Member, Administrator, Moderator Posts: 3,726 admin

    You got the card wet, attempted to clean up stains, remove tape; great dive into the deep end for first attempt. I've read where some remove tape during the wash, or even after, but I always remove mine prior to wash-paper is stronger, and you then have the opportunity to wash away any residue/stains in the wash process if they will come out.

    As for stains on a lobby, i've only paperbacked two and the stains always seem to be deeper, harder to penetrate; maybe some of mine were grease based so maybe even more difficult, but I think the key to removing stains from LC's, 1/2 sheets or Inserts which tend to be a heavier papers is to have longer soak in the deacidification and a longer bleach with of course a weaker bleach. Increasing the length of both will allow the chems to penetrate deeper into the heavier paper and work more effectively. Charlie please confirm/correct as I've not worked with the heavier papers too much.

  • jayn_jjayn_j Member, Singin Dancing Fool, Lobby Master Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller

    Bruce said:

    Definitely masking tape. And you were discounting the major staining in the top. This is the kind that weakens the paper significantly, so you need to handle it quite differently from how you did, or it does "disintegrate".

    But it was a much lesser card anyway, and this is how you learn. But next time ask the boys for tips (based on posted images) before you start, not after!


    right all the way.  It was not only a lesser card, but one where I have duplicates.

    But don't think I haven't read everything posted here and asked questions to boot.  But at some point you have to jump in and take your first shot.  I learned a lot from this exercise, and the next one will be better.  Besides, as sven said, I saved all the pieces and someday I can take a shot at paperbacking and infill.  Never waste a practice piece. :)
    - Jay -
    Curmudgeon in training 
  • jayn_jjayn_j Member, Singin Dancing Fool, Lobby Master Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    One of the problems with choosing lobbies for practice is that condition seems to be inversely proportional to the desirability of the card.  Makes sense if you think of it.  Nobody tapes an Ishtar card to their dorm wall, but that Friday the 13th card gets hung everywhere for the first 10 years until it becomes valuable enough to go into the collector market.  The auction folks are not likely to put cards out that are undesirable and which also need work.  Perhaps Bruce could do a few bulk items for "practice" cards.  I'd bid some $$, but I bet it would go for a price so low as to not be worth his time.
    - Jay -
    Curmudgeon in training 
  • BruceBruce Member, Captain Movie Poster Posts: 799 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    Actually Jay, I think we regularly have lobby card bulk lots that are well suited to "would be restorers". I can't say more, because this is a dealer free zone!
    We (eMoviePoster.com) hold 3,000 auctions a week, 138,000 a year.
    See all of our current auctions in one gallery here: http://www.emovieposter.com/agallery/all.html
  • jayn_jjayn_j Member, Singin Dancing Fool, Lobby Master Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ Daybiller
    I bid on a couple today and immediately got outbid.  will need to either raise my expectations or find something nobody wants.
    - Jay -
    Curmudgeon in training 
  • MirosaeMirosae Member Posts: 851 ✭✭✭ Daybiller

    jayn_j said:

    OK, here are the before and after shots.  My guess is that I should have avoided doing the tape removal while the card was wet.  I was too aggressive in handling it.

    before front:


    before rear:



    And the disaster I created:


    Looking at it now, I thinking this was masking tape and not butcher/brown tape.  should have used Bestine before washing.


    Wow @jayn_j good for you. I am not brave enough and far too clumsy to give it a try. Which is a shame because I think this must be an incredible skill to have.  
    Rosa -
    Love some paper
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